Episode #01 : Creating a Legacy with Mike Baumann
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In this episode of The Richer Geek podcast, I sit down with Michael C. Baumann, a 20-year veteran of enterprise sales and the author of a new young-adult fiction novel, Venom Wars of the Desert Realm.
If you’ve ever wanted to write a book but you thought it would be too daunting, Mike is here to share his tips with us!
In this episode, we chat about…
How Mike approached the process of writing the book
Where new independent authors can find resources to help with DIY self-publishing
Why marketing the book is Mike’s favorite part of the process
We also dive into a profound benefit Mike never expected after his book was published.
Mike’s Top Tips
Keep at it – the more you do it, the better you get at it.
Ask yourself every day: “What can I do TODAY to help this venture move forward?”
Set realistic expectations about pace – realize that this venture may require a slow build and consistent daily action over time to be successful.
+ Read the transcript
Welcome back to the Richer Geek Podcast. I am so excited today to have Mike Bauman with me. Now Mike and I have known each other I think, for about 15 years now. And we've kind of run in the same technology circles. And I became aware that Mike is also an author, he wrote a young adult fiction book. And we'll get into the details of that. What I thought would be really interesting is if you've ever wanted to write a book, or if you've ever been curious, what are the steps and maybe thought it was too daunting, Mike's going to share his experience and his tips and kind of what he went through with us today. So welcome, Mike.
Hello Nichole, thank you for having me. Appreciate it.
Great, great. We're excited to kind of get into this a little bit. But before we get into the book itself, tell us more about yourself just kind of professionally and personally as well.
Sure. Well, I am married - a father for I am currently live in Arizona. And I've been working in the technology space, obviously, where you and I kind of our our paths crossed number of years ago. So we're a large IT integrator, been doing that about 20 years now. And yeah, that's pretty much it, pretty much the family and work keeps me pretty busy.
It's perfect, too. Because in the midst of all that with four kids and working full time and kind of demanding fast paced technology field, then you were also able to write this book. So share a bit about you know, the book itself and the audience, the theme will kind of go from there.
Sure - well, I think you kind of hit it off. It's, it's called venom wars of the desert realm. And it's the home of the first in a series of books on it's an animal horrific animal adventure, if you will, in the spirit of Jr, talking CS Lewis, you know, very good versus evil, idealistic heroes, that sort of thing. kid friendly, generally, middle school cooler ages, where I've seen you know, kids pretty much latch onto it, but I've had kids as young as nine, read the book and enjoy it. Probably the most interesting thing is that I never intended to write a book is probably the most interesting part about this. You know, like many adults that have jobs and families and finances and all these things. I use this as a creative, a cathartic exercise, if you will, I never sat down to say this is going to happen. I just had these ideas for a book that were spinning around in my head and sort of inspired by some of the animals and environment of Arizona. It's almost embarrassing how long it took. Right. I'm I just tinkered with the story for years and years, until I finally felt that there was something tangible, and that's when I really pursued, you know, getting it out into the world and actually making it a book that people could, you know, put their hands on.
Nichole Stohler 2:50
So this is something that on the weekends or after work at night, you would you would just write a couple of pages was it was like a stress relief?
Yeah, that's a great way to put it. Yeah, it was, it was a creative outlet that I could, you know, take things that I was dealing with, and just focus it on a healthy creative outlet. So yeah, it was whenever I could find time, sometimes that'd be really good and I'd write a few weeks in a row or a few days in a row. And because you know, nobody's really pushing me to do this other than myself. I mean, it could be months before I would do any writing. And that's probably one of the biggest challenges, right is that it's not like your job or your home responsibilities. This is kind of on you. And nobody's forcing you to do this by yourself. So the battle is a lot of times with yourself to get this done.
So it I think all total - did you say it took about 10 years maybe to kind of get through?
Yeah, to when it actually became a book and available probably about 10 years. So I'd say, you know, off or on about seven, eight years of actually writing and then by the time I was finished with the book, and I mean the story, probably another year till it actually became a book and it was available to buy and was actually a papyrus, right? So yeah, pretty long process. But glad it finally happened. So.
So tell us about when you got to that point, do you said about seven or eight years ago now it was actually a book now, you thought, Hey, I could do something with this. Tell us about that specific process that you went through to get it published?
Sure. Um, well, you know, it's amazing, because like, in today's world, it really is a DIY world. There's so much out there, you know, whether you're pitching your house or writing a book, right, there's just massive amounts of information. So once I realized that the story was there, and I felt like, Hey, this is something I'm willing to put out in the world, I just really educated myself for a long time. And how I did go to market, there's a lot of companies that will help you self publish, right? I mean, there's literally that's what I would tell him to do is just educate yourself, there's a million different options. What I chose to go through was Amazon, I think they've spun this off now, but it was called create space. And so it's basically Amazon's self publishing arm. And at the time, they had sort of packages, if you will, where they would format your book, you could include a round of editing, and a few other just more tactical things that were involved in setting the book up you know, package A package B package C. So it's actually as a consumers really easy, hey, I want my book I needed edited, I need this. And I, you know, this is in my budget. And that's really, ultimately where I went. And I'm glad I did a lot of research, because there was other firms that were literally like, three, four times as much as Amazon, I think Amazon did an amazing job, And, they really provide you all the tools, outside of the artwork, which is a, I went down a different road for the artwork. But in general, that's really I just started doing a lot of education, talk to anyone that I could who had done this sort of thing, just friends. And ultimately, that's where I came down to the going ahead with the create space arm at Amazon,
Did the create space also provide feedback or recommendations on like an actual editing side of things?
So you could.
Um, so there is called copy editing and line editing. And I'm not sure about this right? copy editing is generally just the more blocking and tackling punctuation, how things are formatted from a structural perspective. And then line editing, I believe is more Hey, how does the story arc flow? And what are the character development, those type of things, I did not choose to go down that secondary road, I had actually even before I went to create space, I'm one of my good friends mother was an English teacher for 30 years. And so I spent a you know, year or two with her just kind of talking about it, and maybe, you know, knocking off some of the rough spots of the story just with her very organically. And again, you know, ultimately kind of wrote it for myself. So I wasn't, I didn't really want to pay somebody else to tell me how to write the book, I guess, is what it came down to. Um, so I didn't go down that road at all, as far as the the more, you know, the creative piece of that, which I'm okay with. And as I continue to write, I mean, I definitely would be open to that. So that was just a choice I had made even probably financial the time, right. I mean, you know, your self funding this project, you know, on your own. So that's, you know, part of it as well.
You know it's interesting, too, I think I like how you said that you had the idea for the way you wanted the words to sound. And you weren't really wanting someone to kind of correct those so to speak. And I could see if it was more like a, like a business reference type of book, maybe that would, out of the gate kind of require that deeper level where someone's kind of looking at it. And because it's not, it's not so much of a story. It's more of, you know, actual facts or information that you're looking to share. So maybe that if you were starting out and you were going to write, you know, kind of more of that business book, maybe then you would probably want to invest in that second level.
Yeah, I definitely think there's value in there, I think and maybe it goes back to where the genesis of why I wrote this, right. I mean, ultimately, I was writing this book for myself, this was a place that I could escape, I could create this world, I could control that, you know, that that whole world, right? So yeah, I, I didn't go down that road. But I definitely think there is value in that. And as I look to continue to write, I think I would you know, I think it's always good to get third party value. I didn't do it not thinking in my book was perfect or anything like that. Right? It was just because I had written it for me. And so I think I was just trying to please myself as far as the story structure and everything went not necessarily the the bigger world, so to speak.
You also had shared So you talked about Amazon create space with the book itself. But then you said you went a different route as it came to the artwork? How did you come about with, you know, the artwork for the book and illustrations within the book?
Sure. That was really exciting, actually. Um, so you know, and I actually do have a friend who has sort of, I created an LLC, called venom wars publishing, right? So I do, I am really trying to make this a business and take this seriously and make this a business venture for myself. Um, so I do have a friend that sort of is invested with me and kind of coaching me at the time. And he had used a company called 99 designs, which for a company logo that he had done, and really what it is, it's a crowdsourcing vehicle. So what I did was I created a contest, if you will, and you can put $1 amount for a prize out there. And I said, The contest is I'm creating, I want cover artwork for the first of a young adult fantasy fiction series. I included a chapter in the book, some character descriptions, kind of what I liked. And maybe if there was artists, I could select, I could actually invite specific artists, if I like their style, and I could invite them to my contest as well. And it was really nice, you could really customize, you know what you want it in and literally within, I mean, a week, I had, I had submissions from all over the globe. I mean, no kidding. I had people from Serbia, I had Brazil, it was just amazing. And ultimately, one other nice thing is so once I had about, I'd say a pretty solid submissions, what I do did was I narrowed down the top five that I liked, and then I ran a contest through their website. And then you could extend it through Facebook, and whatever. And that was actually a really interesting experience as well, because I had my heart set on one of the designs, and I could do it. That's not the design that's on the book today. But the reason I didn't choose that is because of all the polling, you know, polling the contest, if you will. The one that was awarded a lot of the comments from people were, hey, my kid really loves this. That one's really dynamic. And so the feedback, I had to check my ego a little bit on what I liked, and realize, hey, this, this is really what my audience is looking for. This matches to book has the feel of the book. So that was good, it kind of made me realize this is all about me. In that sense, I need understand what outside of the world, you know, what do they want to see in this book. But yeah, it was really awesome. And then after I, the artists who was awarded, it was actually this young man who lives in the Philippines. And he and I collaborated after he won, I commissioned him to do seven more illustrations in the book. So I literally would say, Hey, bud, read chapter two. And I love what you do, give me your interpretation of that and we collaborated. And that was also what took some time too right, to get the book out is that we added artwork, which I don't know if I originally intended to do, but his work was so great. And I think it really added some depth of the story and context to the reader as well as kind of what I was trying to convey in the story. So yeah, so after that we Yeah, we did all that it's pretty wild, right? you're collaborating with somebody halfway around the world that you've never met live on something so important. But it really shows that these tools are out there. I mean, this is a great economy we live in, right? I mean, people have skills, whether that's editing, whether that's art, whether that's copy line, and whatever those things are, there's people out there that can support you. So it's, it's pretty awesome.
It's cool to hear kind of the different tools and resources that you use, and that obviously all help speed up the process. And I like how you call it a DIY world. So let's say okay, so you work through the editing, you have the pictures and the illustrations, you've got the book ready to go. It's up on on Amazon. But that's, that's not it, there was a lot then that probably you had to do around marketing, and so share a little bit of that process that you went through.
Yeah, absolutely. You know, I think one thing I realized that this process is that I'm probably a bit of an outlier as the typical writer. Because, you know, you and I are sales critters, if you will, from from back in the day, right. So you know, reaching out, communicating, doing those things come very natural to us where, you know, when I was, again, educating myself, one of the common themes I saw is that, you know, people would say, hey, you wrote your book, now you got to go sell it. And to me, that was the real fun part. So I'm like, Hey, I love what I did. I'm happy to go share this. So, um, yeah. And I've kind of taken upon myself to I have done some guerrilla marketing, if you will. I've sent my book, a lot of places, I've entered a lot of contests. I paid for some reviews. I know that sounds sort of funny, but it's really, I didn't know what I was going to get out of the reviews. But that gave me some really good third party validation on what I had out there and kind of emboldened me, actually, on one of the reviews made me feel really good. Like, okay, this is something I can feel confident about putting out there in the marketplace.
When you say, and so a couple of these things that you did you entered contests, and you paid for reviews. Now, I know nothing about writing books, and someone listening who might say, Well, where do I get information on that? Are there any sites or information that you can share for those type of resources?
Um, yeah, there's tons of it depends on what you want to do. So there's some reviews on called like, say, for example, readers favorite, that's a very, sort of organic, you and I could end up being, you know, reviewers, if you will, but they have like a staff of writers and you could submit your book and get three different reviews back. And fortunately, I got I got a five star review from them. And some of the the actual, you know, verbiage in the reviews was great. And something I could use, right, it was something I could promote. I also went and used Kirkus review, which is K-I-R-K-U-S, and they're well established book review company out of New York City. And, you know, when Stephen King writes a book, they're going to jump on and review it themselves. But they don't know who Mike Bauman it is, I don't care who my Bauman is, right sucks, but because I'm independent, they, they have an option. So hey, if you're an independent writer, you know, hey, there's X amount of fee, and we will give you a review. And I think that was really valuable. Because, you know, you tend to as you go through this process, like most people, Hey, you know, maybe you have your buddy read this, your your spouse read this, or you know what you're doing, and of course, your friend or your spouse, so they're going to tell you, it's great. But when you you know, you get that third party, this is all these people do. And it's incredible feedback. And I think that's one thing that I think was one of the most valuable just to really get somebody that's not close to me that has no vested interest in what I did, or what I'm doing to get that feedback that was really key.
So I had no idea those kinds of service, that kind of service, or you could submit I just saw, obviously, whenever you look at Amazon, and if someone has purchased a book, if they're a verified purchase, they can leave a review, but had no idea that was kind of third party. So that's super interesting, and good to know. And you know, you also shared you you and I have talked about this a little bit what, what has been kind of the overall biggest well, I won't say one, there's been several benefits for you in writing this book. And, and kind of the exposure you've had. Tell us a little bit about that specifically.
You know, I think one of the biggest things that I think I guess, one, you got to care about what you're doing is one, right? So I think if you go into something like this thinking, Hey, I'm gonna hit the New York Times bestseller, and I'm gonna quit my job. And it's not going to happen, right? I mean, like, it's, it'd be great if it could. But I think for me personally, is because I mentioned I spent so long writing this book, I spent so much time like just chipping away at the story that when I actually held this book, in my hand, it was profound. I was like, wow, this finally happened years and years and years of work. And now actually, I'm holding this artifact. And personally to write I mean, I, we haven't talked a lot of detail the story, but the four main heroes of the story, they're named after my four kids. And so part of that, for me was very fulfilling to say, Hey, I can give this book to my kids. And one day they'll show their kids and say your granddad wrote this book. And, and I'm in it right. So it was very personal. I mean, I think that's the biggest thing is that it was very fulfilling. Because yeah, it looks and nobody pushed me to do this. Nobody forced me to do this, nobody paid me to do this. This was something that, you know, once again, I had that momentum, and I felt there was something there it was, it was really great to see all that work. Finally, you know, come to this culmination and a book that I can hold in my hands.
And it's it's cool to how you describe something that your kids can show their kids and it can be passed down, you've created a very tangible era, if you will, that that other people are enjoying not just your family, and I'm sure they're super excited to be, you know, to say my dad's an author. And here's, here's what he put together.
No, absolutely. You know, and it's, it's funny, I can just give you a little anecdote to so one of our neighbors across the street, they have a nine year old boy. And so of course, I you know, went to give him my book. And a few weeks later, after giving my book, there was a knock at the door. And he had made a, you know, a 10 page book with illustration that he wrote, and he wrote a note to me, Hey, you, you give me your book. Here's my book. And so I think that's really exciting to you, right? I mean, you, you're touching people's lives, and whether you know it or not, it's like, life's tough, life's crazy, life's hard. And you bring a little bit of joy or happiness. I mean, that's, you know, it sounds sort of idealistic, but almost as valuable as even financially, right. It's kind of cool, knowing that you've had an impact like that.
That is a good story. And it's cute, it's cute that he and he now you can in a way, you can kind of give him some guidance and help him through what he might want to do with that at some point. So we've kind of talked about the process that you went through, and, you know, the fact that it's amazing to finally be holding this book that that took so long to to really put together. What are some of the biggest challenges that you've say you experienced? Besides the fact that you were writing while working full time with kids? And, you know, putting that aside, once you publish the book, what are kind of some of the challenges that you've seen?
Mike Bauman 18:33
Um, yeah. And it maybe goes back to that DIY comment, right? I mean, the good news is you can self publish a book. The other news is that everyone can self publish a book, right? So I think there's every year there's literally like, a million new independently, it's crazy, but there's a lot of noise out there. So, you know, if you're trying to take yourself or make this venture serious, and you want it to get out there, I mean, there's a lot of noise. So how do you differentiate yourself? So I've, I think that's one of the biggest things, you believe, you know, I'm a very romantic guy, right? Like, Hey, I'm gonna put my book on Amazon, and I'm gonna wake up and a million copies are sold. didn't quite work that way. But that's okay. Right. That is not how it works. But I think that's one that I think that's when setting expectations is key. But gosh, there's so much information on self publishing and authors that are doing it, I mean, you really can get a good perspective of what what's going on out there. And I think the thing is just to really believe in what you're doing, because I think that's where I'm at now is because I, I think the story is good and people like it, it really, that's the fire behind me to keep pushing this to keep sending it out to keep talking to people, you know, trying to do a lot of stuff organically too as a matter of fact, this weekend, you know, down here in Tucson, we have book men's right, and they're doing a youth Book Festival this weekend and invited to be a part of that. There's been schools that I've read at. So just really trying to focus almost organically and locally in the state. I've done Tucson Comic Con last year, I'm going to be at the top Phoenix fan fusion, the Comic Con up in Phoenix next month. Um, so that's really been my focus is on trying to, you know, spread the word organically and locally. And, and, you know, again, like, those are the things on a bigger front. But that is a challenge is you know, you do all this effort, and you get it out there and you're like, Okay, then you see you've sold five books, and you know, and a month, right. So that's I think just being realistic of what what is out there and what you're competing against is that's that's definitely a challenge, right? Because we all have an idea of these idealistic vision of, you know, hitting the New York Times bestseller right, the day after it's published. And that's not the case. But that's okay. I mean, I've also, as I've thought about this book, and sort of what I want to see a success down the road, I sort of have like a three or four year window of this book, right? where, you know, and I mean, that from a commercial financial perspective, where I'd like to see some momentum. And I think, you know, books a little bit different than music, or a piece of art or a restaurant or something where you can consume that super quick, you can hear a song and hey, I like it, or I don't like it or that piece of art, I like or don't, you know, reading a books of commitment, it takes time. Like, there's literally, you know, you have to take mental time and energy to commit to a book. So I just know, inherently that's a longer cycle of things, you know, is that you're getting something to market. Right. And, and so yeah.
Yeah, I think, you know, it's interesting as we talk on this podcast about other areas, like, for example, real estate investing, or, you know, building a small business. Maybe in some cases, like you said, like a piece of art, it's a very quick type of thing. But I think with those types of things that can be sustainable over the long run, there is a slow build, it does take time, you do not go out and buy one house and rent it and make enough money to to quit your job, you absolutely do not. There's a build. And what you're describing is that exact same thing, and it also is consistency, which also is what you're describing, it's consistently going to events and continuing to market. It's not giving up, because you woke up in the morning and you didn't sell any books. It's saying this is a good story it touches lives. I'm going to continue to get that message out there. And I think I think it's great that you you're letting our listeners understand the right expectations. But you're also like you said, you're taking a long term commitment to this. So in in that, what are you looking to do next? I mean, you mentioned that you have an LLC, you've really structured this as a business itself. What is it that you're looking to do next?
Sure, um, well, I think the key thing is to keep writing, and not spend eight years on the next book, which is interesting, as you know, just as it as I re-read my book, as I'm writing the second book, I can tell that I think even some of the early chapters are a little bit clunkier as I, as I get going later in the book, they get a bit better. And it's just because I was writing more when I got more experienced at writing. But yeah, I think, you know, being passionate about something is key, right? I mean, I, you know, one thing that it's given me, you know, it's been really exciting as a new chapter of my life, this is something outside of my work outside of my kids, something I can focus on. And, and literally, I ask myself, every day when I wake up, what can I be doing to help promote this book? And, you know, I've done things, I've sent my book to celebrities, I met some interesting writers. I mean, I've done just just trying to think outside the box, because, you know, as much as I'd love to have my Instagram and have a million followers, that may take some time, but maybe somebody already has a million followers that gets my book that happens to like it that that's really, you know, again, that's the kind of exciting part of our world, right? I mean, the scale is there, you know, and I always said, like, even my decision to be on Amazon, you know, they've got 330 million users, right? I just needed a quarter of a percent to like my book and things change quickly in life. Right. So yeah, I just think that's, I mean, I think you whatever your it is, whether that you like you mentioned, real estate or whatever your it is, I think, you know, caring, because if you don't, it's the grind will be rough. Right? So you just, I think, you know, that's for me, it's just I care about this thing, I think it's worthy. And I'm just trying to really think outside the box on how I get it out in the world.
Well, thank you for sharing all of that with as I we have a lot of notes, and we'll have details in the show notes about some of the resources that you mentioned, specifically, the copying and editing and also the review sites and some of those things, oh, and the site that helps you with your artwork and all of those pieces. So if anyone else's, you know, looking to write a book, they can check out those resources. Now, how can listeners stay in touch with you or learn more about your book besides going to Amazon.
Right, right, of course, you know, um, yeah, you know, I'd say if you I'm pretty active on Instagram, and Facebook, so it'd be at Michael C. Bauman, Michael C. Bauman, excuse me. And that's right, the easiest way, you know, and I'd even welcome if they're, if there's listeners out there that had kids are in school, and, you know, maybe they'd be interested if they think the story is appropriate to come and do some reading. That's always great, right? That's part of this organic thing. And I want to get young users and readers to like the story and have them spread the word for me as well. Right. So I'm happy to do those sorts of things. But yeah, I, if anyone wants to have any conversation, you know, there is so much out there. And I think it's, it's good to get a sounding board. So I'm always open to chatting with people. And I know we've discussed this, but when people ask, you know, it's really funny, when you tell somebody, you've written a book, almost to a person, the first thing that they say is, yeah, I've had this idea for a book, I was going to do something and I immediately say, go do it. Because you can now write even if you don't publish it, even if you don't get it out there, I think there's so much value in having a creative, it, whatever it is, whether it's a business book, or whether it's a fictional book, or wherever it is, I think there's something really valuable in using our brains that way. Um, because, you know, we see so often get in a rut and, you know, kids and schedules and finances and all these things that it's nice to actually have something that's outside of that, that that's good for our brain.
Thank you so much for sharing that and taking us through this journey and giving us some of the resources and your experiences and really appreciate you coming on today.
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ABOUT MIKE BAUMANN
Michael C. Baumann is a graduate of the University of Arizona. He has spent the last twenty years in enterprise sales for a Fortune 500 global IT company.
As the son of a submariner in the US Navy, Michael has lived all over the United States, from his birth-state of Hawaii to his current home in Tucson, Arizona.
He and his wife have four children, to whom he has dedicated Venom Wars of the Desert Realm--and after whom four of his fictional heroes are named.