#109: How the World is Reacting to Mines vs. The Economy Supply Chain
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Today, we're happy to have Max Porterfield. Max is the CEO President and Director of Callinex Mines. And what we're going to talk about today is just a little bit about the economy supply chain, what they're doing and how the world is reacting to mines and what it is that he's seeing in the macro and microeconomics of, of the whole system and the business. And I think it'd be very interesting for our listeners to have what Max says.
Mr. Porterfield is well-known in Canada’s metal market. A graduate of Texas Tech University with a bachelor’s degree in business administration, Max has over ten years of experience in natural resources and finance; he previously worked with Brazil Resources Inc., Uranium Energy Corp., and U.S. Global Investors. Max has a vibrant and charismatic personality that comes across in his interviews. He is passionate and LOVES what he does.
In this episode, we’re discussing…
[2:10] What Callinex is and what is doing right now
[4:13] How the copper supply chain works and the challenges it has
[6:41] The huge demand for metal (copper) vs. the tight supply it should have and the global infrastructure
[9:48] People want Electric Vehicles, but they’re partially against mining and the supply sources
[14:10] The geopolitical risk associated with the supply constraints around the metal
[17:00] They’re now positioned in a safe jurisdiction, proximity infrastructure, clean power at a key time on the macro and microeconomic level
[19:25] How this huge inflation will impact commodities, copper, silver, zinc, and gold?
[23:03] If they have any pushback in the local provinces or in the different areas where they find these discoveries
[26:36] What’s Max and this company's proudest moment to date
[29:39] How high does the copper is going to get due to the demand and if they’re stealing copper from everywhere
[31:40] What are some of the things and what is it like to run a company like this?
[34:11] How does he look at his company and himself in five years, where does he see coming next, and what’s his goal is
Resources from Max
+ Read the transcript
Mike Stohler
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Alright, everybody, welcome back to the Richer geek podcast today. We're happy to have Max Porterfield. Max is the CEO President and Director of Callinex Mines. And what we're going to talk about today is just a little bit about the economy supply chain, what they're doing and how the world is reacting to minds and what it is that he's seeing in the macro and micro economics of, of the whole system and the business. And I think it'd be very interesting for our listeners to have what Max says How're you doing, Max?
Max Porterfield
I'm doing great, really excited here today.
Mike Stohler
So Callinex mines is a Canadian mining company. That that goes back a long time, you know, from the 1920s. I think I read. How are you guys seeing you get we talked a little bit about you guys are in the copper right now. Tell us kind of how Callinex is doing, you know, and what they're doing right now. And what your plans are.
Max Porterfield
Yeah, so we're we're an exploration stage company, there's three phases in the mining business is exploration, development and actual production side of the equation, really, where you can make a lot of money, the most money in the industry, or the sector is with an exploration because that's similar to a biotech company of biotech companies doing research and development, per se, or, you know, any kind of tech companies de risking through their, you know, our research and development arm. And then as you hit different milestones in the risky asset, or the drug, per se, through clinical trials, you add value to your shareholder base, and then the company's valuation increase in lockstep. And so callinectes is focused on is in the copper space on just you know, base and precious metals minds, the BMS minds, they're kind of a nickname forum for volcanogenic, massive sulfide. But quite simply, we're in the copper business, we're exploring for base and precious metals. And key time for the supply, supply demand are really favoring higher prices, which is going to benefit us. So what colonics has done is it's hit a very high grade copper discovery in northern Manitoba, where we have a long history, and a key time for the community to flagship mines shutting down in May of this year. This is also in the backdrop kind of on the global supply crunch for copper. It's not just driven by kind of COVID related supply chain problems, but really a lack of investment over the past decade, if not longer for these base metal mines. Because they're very, very difficult to find the challenging, and that's really where the reward is. So that's what we're focused on kind of bigger picture.
Mike Stohler
I can't imagine what goes into digging a hole that big and trying to find copper. I mean, it has to be, you know, what we're thinking about with r&d, research and development, but just the equipment and the manpower. I mean, how long does it usually take, you know, you have something and now you have to explore in hopes of finding it. And that has to be just a huge undertaking.
Max Porterfield
I mean, there's a lot of thought process that goes into targeting exploration. So you know, our version of clinical trials and comparing to biotech stock, yeah, is that we call the truth mainstream truth machine in terms of drilling. And so you have a hypothesis of thesis based on where you think the deposit would sit in 3d space underground. And then ultimately test that hypothesis through drilling, to we drill a hole, but two and a half inches in diameter is different target areas. And once you're successful, and you hit a discovery, which is the first step in the long, long process, and you start delineating the deposit was step out drilling, where you essentially move out 50 100 meters 75 meters away from where you previously drilled, put another hole, in, you delineate deposit that way. So that's That's where we are.
But in terms of timelines, you know, a lot of people don't appreciate the copper supply chain. In the copper business, the timeline from a discovery hole to production is on average, seven years. So say you, you make a discovery, which is very challenging to do, there's still, you know, a long road ahead until it actually hits the supply chain, which is I think, what the world doesn't truly understand right now, you know, government policies put in place, this big shift away from the hydrocarbon oil and gas, and that can only be replaced by really one thing, and that's the metals in base metals really keeps the electric vehicle revolution.
You know, if you look at these SUVs that are from an Eevee vehicles, you're talking 150 pounds of copper. Wow, this is all being, you know, government policies, putting in place mandates that all vehicles need to be electric by certain timeframes, which is going to put a huge demand driver on the demand side at a time, we've got a really limited supply. Now we're looking to kind of shorten that gap with our discovery at Rainbow because it's located in proximity to infrastructure at a key time where that infrastructure is do sit idle with the 777 minutes operating the town of CO Flin Flon Manitoba is shutting down in this May of this year. So well, we're looking to achieve is obviously going to accelerate that timeline, from the typical, you know, seven years to a few years, because you're in proximity and infrastructure power, you know, water, road access, and all those type of things really reduce your timelines. But that's just kind of bigger picture in terms of the supply challenges in the metals market, but people don't really readily appreciate.
Mike Stohler
Yeah, it goes. I think you were talking earlier that there's only three days supply.
Max Porterfield
Yeah, right now, it's incredible the supply, you know, above ground inventories and elemi, you know, just over three days supply. So it's very tight supply. But at the same time, demands, it's not going to fall off, I mean demands only getting stronger. And it's government policy when we just talked about Evie, but there's all the infrastructure around specifically just electric vehicles and how you're going to charge them with super chargers, and what have you, all a huge consumptions of metals. And then broader picture us infrastructure, global infrastructure. The One Belt, One Road initiative out of out of China, is an infrastructure plan that really dwarfs anything that we talk about the United States. And you can imagine that, and all these are going to put big, big demand on base metals, if you're really having a flurry of activity in terms of where's the world going to supply this because in the copper space, for examples, it's wrong, we're obviously have a high grade copper discovery, the global average grade a copper mine, globally is half a percent.
And that's from these big low grade open pit operations. Like in Chile, Peru, Arizona, as well, is a big producer of copper in the United States. And these big low grade deposits oftentimes may not have the cleanest energy source, it's generating the production of those metals. So that calls into question when you go and buy your Tesla, Evie, yeah, right where you be or, you know, battery powered small clients, or what have you, is How clean is a really for the environment when you don't take into account really for the diamond supply chain. And so that's where we're looking to stand out with what we've discovered, it's called the rainbow deposit. It's one of the highest grade copper deposits discovered. In North America more recently, I'm sure that on a global basis, based upon drilling to date, to be in the top 10 highest grade copper mines, for example, you need to have just over 3.75% copper.
And if you look at the supply, for those are those mines are located a large number of those top 10 mines in terms of grade around the world are in Central Africa, like the DRC. So you know, what we have is a very, very high grade copper discovery in a safe jurisdiction and a really critical time for our community. And we also benefit from hydroelectric power. So that's where you're going to really get clean copper concentrate that really meet the long term objectives of these economies. And really, the government policy that's been put in place to move away from the hydrocarbon is with a kind of a clean copper concentrate. And so it's not just how its source, but you know, what are the grades of the mines? And how, what is the energy power that's being powered or generated to power, the production of these critical metals to shift the world into this kind of cleaner area?
Mike Stohler
How are you dealing or is there any you know, political ramifications? Seems like all these people that want EVs and they want the cleaner? Cars I have a Tesla x I don't know how many pounds of copper I have. No, hopefully it's it's good. But it seems like the same people they're wanting all these EVs are also partially against mining. Yeah, well, there's gonna be a bit
Max Porterfield
of a revolution with the miners here because you can't have you can't have both one without the other. Right. So you're right. You're absolutely I think what the mining companies need to do a better job of is up We see ESG environment, sustainable growth in the mining industry. And that's one of the things you're seeing, that's becoming a bigger talking point in action point, really, from the producers, you know, all the way down to the explorers like ourselves, you know, in terms of what we're onto. And what we're really, our long term vision has been to this. So the world has kind of come into our favor, so to speak. Because this has been a long term objective, it's not something that we just suddenly thought it was a good idea. So you know, you're right, you need to have a critical look at your supply source. And understand that if you want to have a shift away from oil and gas, you're going to have to need the metals, because you can physically touch it. It's either been grown, pumped, or mined. And I can tell you that your house generation from your car's not going to be grown, and even then maybe all this deforestation associated with that. So you know, there's a give and take that has to be made. I think everybody understands what the long term of Dec objectives are. And it's just about meeting those long term objectives and sustainable way, which is where we're looking to can fill that gap.
Mike Stohler
Yeah, you know, one thing that I remember that Elon Musk had mentioned is, it's all said, Good that you want all these EVs, but we don't have the electricity capabilities to put all these EVs on the road.
Max Porterfield
Yeah, and then you're going that's just the production of the EVS. Then you're looking at the electrical grid to power the EVS and what is it baseload power generation coming from in the United States? So you know, I think there's, there's gonna be a mix, certainly nuclear is going to be an important role in Intel that comes clean, low cost, power generation, you also geothermal, solar, wind, all those type of things need to kind of come together for an energy mix, to create a sustainable baseload power generation source that then can supply the EVS because I mean, EVs are just one thing. I mean, if you look at a small combustion motor, whether it be in a lawn more, those types of, you know, small motors that are actually very, very big pollutants. I know, the state of California, for example, is looking to do away with those, and they all need to transition to a battery powered, but again, it goes back to your supply sources. And not only that, you know, in terms of getting supply, getting the supply and sustainable way. But then where do you get that supply in a sustainable way? Understand the geopolitical risks associated with a lot of the world's mind supply?
Mike Stohler
Yeah, yeah, it's very well and good, just say, do it. You know, like they do in California? Well, we're just gonna ban all blowers, ban all gas. lawnmowers. But there has to be a thought process of ways that you know, what, you know, how are we going to do it? And, and what does it take to do it,
Max Porterfield you saw something similar in the platinum Marina, in terms of the metal platinum, back in the early 2000s, when all cars needed to have a catalytic converters with well didn't realize is that every single catalytic converter has a little bit of platinum in it. And that's why oftentimes, you read on the news, or, you know, thieves are going out and cutting out, you know, the catalytic converter outside of cars, they're doing that to get that little bit of platinum in the big demand shift that had in the platinum market. Yeah, it was a really good time to be in the platinum space, because, again, you had a new demand source that's been thrust upon a metal with this very finite supply. And so you know, if you just don't just turn on the tap, so to speak, like you can in oil and gas scenario, where you have a much quicker path to production, to get any one of those metals, and really the only way to solve that problem is with higher prices, because higher prices are going to incentivize the exploration development for new mines. And so you know, they oftentimes the cure for higher prices is higher prices. And so that's been, you know, the case right now with copper is, you have the whole world looking around for the supply constraints in pointing the finger towards the pandemic, or what have you. The reality is, is if you look during the pandemic, mine supply, and copper is about six 7%, that came off, just for a number of months, I think you really need to look at the geopolitical risk associated with the supply constraints around the metal, for example, the recent elections in Chile and Peru, going to more of a socialist regime that historically has led to a lot of problems operating minds in those economies, because again, as a socialist economy might, you know, come in and have more demands and before it really is gonna have an impact on operation when has an effect on operations gonna have an impact of global mind supply, which again, is very, very sensitive right now, in general, people don't really appreciate how sensitive it truly is.
Mike Stohler
And you know, one of the fears might be that those type of countries that are turning more socialist might give their first batches of their first haul to like China or to Russia. And we'll say like, well, the rest of the world may not get first dibs, because they're more maybe aligned with the other countries? No, definitely,
Max Porterfield
I think you need to look at supply sources. I think they defy, so to speak, when I say that I'm talking about the US, UK, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, are all systematically looking out and going to see where are we going to meet the supply for economies. And in fact, I mean, in many ways, the export credit agencies for the five eyes are going around and looking to backstop financing, for the, for these deposits, they go into production with some security that they're going to get off take, or their economy. And so you know, if you look at the normal discount rate for a base metal project, you'll have you know, 8%, but you can go now and get 80%, you know, the basically long story innovate is, you know, you go and get a bankable feasibility study audit on a deposit to go into production, and the bank will give you the debt financing, it's a mix of debt and equity, obviously, no, or taking that deposit into production.
But now, the these economies of these governments are going to backstopping 80% of that debt and artificially low interest rates. So instead of 8%, you're talking 2%, which is going to obviously, be a big, big benefit to bring a lot of these Evie centric ESG projects online, and a much more favorable financing terms than ever before. And that's really going out to secure the supply away. Because I mean, in many ways, I think we're in a new Cold War that's taking place around the world. And the bargaining chip, you can see, particularly with what's going on in Russia in the Ukraine right now, in that instance, is going to be the commodities. I mean, oftentimes you look at foreign policy, it's really dictated around this the sourcing of some sort of a commodity, whether it be oil historically been a popular one, a natural gas is one right now, obviously natural gas in Europe is heavily tied to to Russia. And so again, it's where do you fit in this whole game? And you know, I like to be positioned in a safe jurisdiction, proximity, infrastructure, clean power at a key time on the macro micro economic level, with the the town meeting that discovery.
Mike Stohler
So I think what you're saying also that, which is good that the central banking system is pro what you're doing. So there are some opportunities, there's not shutting you guys down, they're not giving you guys in the high interest rates in order to make it not feasible.
Max Porterfield
Well, it's yeah, what I was alluding to with all that is the government's are coming around to secure supply for their economies, they're looking to backstop it at you basically, you know, your your debt financing is going to be backed by the whatever government's giving you export agencies giving that line of credit, but they're wanting some surety on some level of offtake for those economies, is what I was mentioning there. And in terms of geopolitical risks. I mean, we love being an explorer, slash developer, because we're moving towards shifting towards that, in tandem with our exploration efforts in an area that's produced 32 Mines. So this is a new business in the area that we're operating in. and Canada overall, is really a source for financing in really a human capital source for the exploration efforts, not just North America, but truly on a global basis. The world does turn to Canada, Canada has historically been a leader in that sector. So it's a great jurisdiction operating, obviously, everything kind of ongoing right now. With the protests and how that's being handled, can be looked at differently. But ultimately, you want to be in North America, if you want to be anywhere in my opinion, you know, oh, yeah, why not creation in a country like Canada is gonna be very, very key. It also opens a lot of doors, you know, when when you're looking to create jobs for your economy and a key time for the community level. That's, you know, been a a tax contributor, driver of tax revenue for the Province of Manitoba and the federal government, for example, for over 100 years, to solve a sudden becoming a potential liability. When you have a solution to that problem you're really going to stand out in there's gonna be a lot of people, you know, waiting to help when they can.
Mike Stohler
Now we've had 2021 especially, and looks like it's not going to stop anytime soon. You know, we've had most inflationary years since probably the late 70s. How is that impacting commodities, like, you know, the copper, silver, gold, zinc? And what kind of insights can you share with us on how you think it's all going to affect those commodities?
Max Porterfield
Well, I mean, inflation in an inflationary environment, like the 1970s and today It's gonna be very, very good for commodities because, you know, you look at commodities in the price in US dollars. So as US dollar weakens, you can take more dollars to buy the same commodity. So it's really a national hedge to inflation would be in, in the commodity space, whether it be precious metals, you know, same thing for real estate are those type of things all perform well in an inflationary environment. But what's really underpinning I think, the long term supercycle pretty late for the base metals, as well as gold and silver, and the precious metal side of things, is going to be the supply side. Because it's been really, truly a lack of investment in the exploration, these discoveries. And you can see that through the entire, you know, sector, whether it be you know, judges copper, look at Gold, you've got declining grades of discoveries, the size of these discoveries are becoming smaller and more more infrequent.
And so you've got to look and explore in different ways. And that's really the story for calyxes case, with the rainbow deposit is looking at sure mining camp, but it can't produce 32 mines. And you know, you could have a negative view on that and say, Hey, all the mines been found in this area, there's nothing to look for there, we took a different lens in different perspective. And we thought, you know, there's obviously a pedigree, there's an mineral endowment potential there, we need to look in new ways. And so again, the only things gonna incentivize that's higher prices, and thinking outside the box. But truly, the driver of all this is the easy discoveries have been made, in many ways, technology has not advanced is readily in the mining space, as you see advanced amount of capital that goes into it in oil and gas, per se. And that's all coming to an end here, you know, I mean, you know, push comes to shove, if you need the metals, you're going to have to look for other ways, and in new places, were more remote, and that's all gonna lead to higher costs associated with that. So you know, that's one of the key strategies we've employed has always been in proximity infrastructure where you want, it can be obviously a much cleaner footprint, a smaller footprint, but you're up for capital costs, to explore for these deposits is much, much lower cost than when you're going remote. When you're going remote, you're setting up a camp, you're taking people water power, and helicopter access in and out is just much more costly in the exploration stage, as well as the development stage. If you look at a remote discovery, oftentimes, the capex for these deposits, are in over a billion dollar capex if not higher, to get all the people the power, the water, all that out there to these large deposits. And so you know, you need a sustainable long term price move to really create the necessity, you know, these things to come to fruition. Whereas I think the way to mitigate risk is obviously going in proximity infrastructure we can leverage off of that we're threshold for something to be economic is much, much lower, because you don't have to rebuild all that infrastructure that was already put in place there from a previous mining operation.
Mike Stohler
How much pushback do you get, you know, when you go and you make a discovery, like with the local provinces, and just trying to say, hey, you know, we want to come out here and just do this big thing, because we have this big discovery. Are you getting any pushback, you know, from the different areas that where you find these discoveries?
Max Porterfield
No, actually, I mean, that's, that's again, going back to being aligned with the micro economic situation within these known and established Canadian mining jurisdictions, the town of Flin. Flon where rainbow is located just a half hour drive away by existing road access, we're actually within a mineral lease what's advanced permitting, we see within 200 meters of a hydroelectric power line, and that that flagship mine that's operated by the mid tier company, Hudbay, is shutting down in May of this year. So again, two and a half months away from a firm shutdown date. For a mine, that's the really the sole driver of the economy for the community. This is a town of 5000 people, and 785 direct jobs going down to 50 by next year. And that's just direct jobs. Due to the mine. Of course, there's always the local economy that surrounds that anchor mind. And so again, when you have a discovery that can take the pressure off the community, because there hasn't been another discovery that's been made, that's going to is readily in the arms, waiting to go into production after 777 shuts down, really opens up a lot of doors and three get a lot of support on the community level, because they understand the positive impact that you can have. And, you know, really stemming a lot of job losses that are inherent in that community and that's what we're looking to achieve with our discovery.
Mike Stohler
What is your with with talking about callin x? What's the comparison or can you make one between like your market cap and your peer group companies? How are you guys you know, because you're your public company, how can you like prove that under five valuation.
Max Porterfield
So in terms of valuation, you know, there's other companies with similar assets that have market capitalizations of 150 million 200 million up to 500 million. Depending where you look, I think one of the key things for us has been, we've gotten delayed by assay results coming from the lab on the Discovery rainbow. And we're more readily known for assets in the Maritimes that are zinc lead focused, as well. So as we shift to a brand new discovery, that's where you can have the biggest revaluation for the company, today we're sitting with a mark have roughly 30,000,001 of the key things, you know, I think that is going to change at the very short term or near term is again, being able to process additional assay results from the discovery. So assay results are essentially the laboratory results after you drill a hole they process it and tell you exactly how much metals in the hole that you drilled.
And that's key to to delineating a deposit, and then publishing a maiden resource because we're pre resource at Rainbow. When we entered 2021, we only had three holes into the discovery is brand new. Since that time, we've drilled over 71 holes in the deposit area. And so we're gonna be publishing maiden resource, which is going to be key milestone for discovery is your first resource. And that's where you have a third party engineering firm, you know, model independently, how much metal is actually in the deposit that you've drilled. And that, again, is, I think, a key milestone in catalysts where we can get a big revaluation that's not too far off in the distant future for the company, and something that we're working on right now. With, you know, someone that we had hired to complete that work.
Mike Stohler
What is your you know, I know, You've been with this company a little while, what's your proudest moment to date?
Max Porterfield
Where was that discovery rainbow. I mean, that's the discovery of one of the highest grade copper deposits out there at a key time for a local community. That's been a long term objective. That was an objective that when I joined the company, we had a big management shift at Callen x in mid 2014, was to find Flin Flon, its next mine. And so to hit that discovery, and really the height of the pandemic, where there was peak amount of fear, I was certainly not living in a state of fear myself, because I had an opportunity to be out there at the drill when we made that discovery. So that was the first moment. And certainly, there's gonna be many more new moments, as we continue to hit milestones in really 2022 is the year to publish a maiden resource on Rainbow. But also the year that we're looking to make discoveries of other deposits in the area, there's what we've done is we've taken the the toolset in kind of the mindset in the mosaic, so to speak, and we created to find rainbow and we expanded that on a very large scale across our land package in a new way. So no one had ever found rainbow or look for mine in that specific way in the area. That's where you're getting to change your mindset to change your outcome. Now that we have rainbow, we have as a footprint and kind of a playbook. We've expanded that playbook on entire property area. And that's something else we're looking to achieve his his rainbow and beyond in 2022 is, is finding another one or two rainbows to get those into the pipeline would be guessing my next proudest moment I'm looking to achieve, you know, I don't know not satisfied, but but certainly rainbow and the discovery was the proudest moment to date. And as we move forward and hitting different milestones, we're looking to replace that memory.
Mike Stohler
So your definition probably for like a successful year for Kellen X would be not only to keep rainbow going but to have a couple more of these discoveries. And that would just kind of put the icing on the cake for 2022.
Max Porterfield
Absolutely, that's that's just reaching really critical scale, because then you're you have no one operation and rainbow in a pine Bay, which is an adjacent deposit, but you're looking at, you know, 123 others, if everything you know, plays out, I think that we're going to be very, you know, when we looked at how many target areas that we had with our new approach to exploration in Manitoba, we had an end to four target areas. And we obviously discovered rainbow was one of those four target areas. And so looking forward into 2022, we have, you know, six or seven target areas, we've been outlined a few of them already to the market and there'd be more to come. And you know, I think we're doing that in a much more refined manner than even when we what was leading up to the discovery rainbow right, we've taken that and then when the more data you get just like an a biotech, more research you get back and the further you get in the process, the more you learn and the more effective you can be at exploration and that's what we're looking to prove and achieve this year.
Mike Stohler
How high do you think copper is going to get you know, you know, here in the United States you know, if they're stealing copper everywhere, you know, I'm they're going into home stealing all the copper pipes, they've even gone and with the superchargers cut the lines of the superchargers to get the copper, you know, it's are you just seeing that foreseeable future is just going to keep going up and up and up and up because of the demand.
Max Porterfield
Yeah, again, you have to have higher copper supply, to incentivize new supply. And I'm not the only one, I mean, Goldman Sachs Bank of America, they're all saying the same thing in terms their analysts looking down on supply chain is that you're not getting the supply response and copper, and that's really, truly unprecedented. Right. And that's going back to a long term systemic problem, because again, when I joined Callen, x 2014, it was not sexy to be a copper explorer, it was not you were looking at a $2 copper environment. So you need to sustain higher price action in the underlying metal to incentivize companies like Callen X, to go out there and explore for new mines. And again, you're talking a supply delay, that, you know, seven years from a discovery to production, on average. So it's not like these are just going to turn on all of a sudden.
And there's other things that go in line with that. I mean, if you're looking at, you know, deposits very remote, we talked about the big upfront capex that can prevent an asset for going to production, the timelines, I'm taking a very remote access, acid production as well, the risks associated with producing very remote, all these types of things are gonna have a big, big impact on the world, you know, meeting the industry meeting the world's demands for the metal. And so I don't think it's gonna be anything new to see the copper stolen when we saw the copper cylinder in the last cycle with this cycle has a lot more going for it even than the previous supercycle and commodities that ended with the financial crisis in 2008. Because you haven't had any investment in supply.
Mike Stohler
Yeah, yeah. Now, he joined the company in 2014. And I mean, it's got to be from where it was to where you're going now? I mean, what are some of the things and what is it like to run a company like this?
Max Porterfield
Well, there's certainly never a dull moment. I mean, you know, in terms of risk perspective goes, I mean, colonics and expirations, a very, very high risk endeavor. Because the statistical odds of making a discovery that goes into a producing asset on an industry wide basis is one in 4000. And I think, obviously, that's a very high risk business. But that's why the reward is so high as well, when you make a discovery, and you can delineate it, because these mines are truly valuable. If you look at the 777, mine is shutting down in May, that's sort of over a billion dollars in tax revenue alone. So we're talking about a big, big business a big, big opportunity. And you know, the way you direct you, you minimize risk and a high risk environment is, you know, again, proximity infrastructure, the pedigree, obviously, the infrastructure been put in there, because of the pedigree of the geologist put in place other deposits and Fern, don't have done in production. But it's, you know, it's very, very exciting. I am certainly passionate about what we do. And the whole team is passionate about what we do. I mean, some of the things I haven't mentioned, as you know, my background is traditionally in finance. And so when you come into a business like Callan X, you really need to bring the technical expertise, which is one of the key things I focus on doing right out of the gate, where our technical team has actually been credited with finding three of the four largest minds in this town's history. So it's all about people today, managing eccentric people. I mean, we've got a great team, I and, you know, this exciting business. And certainly every day, there's something new that's going on that you would never thought would imagine that would occur that happens. But then you kind of have the your constant living on the, the high, so to speak of making a discovery, because truly, I wish I had a piece of cool with me right now at show, you know, your listeners couldn't see what I'm describing. But when you're looking at a piece of high grade copper, you know, I can be in a really bad mood and turn really happy with snap of a finger.
Mike Stohler
I can't imagine because that's the future the company is finding those things. What is your if you could look out five years from now, where do you see coming next? What's your goal?
Max Porterfield
Well, I think you know, callinectes in the cycle is is a is an exploration company. So yeah, well, often than not, exploration companies are swallowed by larger companies or producers. So I think that's naturally what's going to happen to a company like callinectes or any company that's successful in the exploration front, particularly right now. Because these big producers need to backfill their, their, their mind supply, right, I mean, they're producing that's what they're good at their expertise is, is getting the metal out of the ground and into the homes and through the supply chain. And the only way to do that is either you have to be experts at finding mines yourself, which is again, a very specific tool setting and they do have, you know, exploration departments of these mid tiers and majors, but also what they like to do and it's just natural part of the business is The acquisition of eggs, you know, exploration stage assets that are transitioning to be producers, where you really get that big revaluation in your company.
And then you get taken out. And so you know, whether Callen ik sticks around and transitions to producer is a possibility, a distinct possibility. But certainly as the world's appetite increases, and you have all these supply drivers, and we have a lack of discoveries, these big producers are going to really be looking at it very aggressively in terms of, hey, how do we feed our future supply for production because they have their own production profiles that they've got to maintain, to keep the valuations that they are at. And that's an intrinsic part of the business is the explorers get acquired by the developers and producers and producers go on, to produce and make money in that way. And again, that's why exploration, while it's the highest risk part of the business, because you're coming from a concept in your turning into proof of concept, and as you drill it out, you show it to reality, and de risk it that way. That's where you create the most amount of value for your shareholder base.
Mike Stohler
Well, this has been fascinating, Max. You know, for everyone that is curious about Callen X website is callin x, it's ca L L I N E x.ca. You can find out what kind of projects that are doing. And they are a the corporate overview if you're interested in getting involved with some of the you know, being an investor, but Max has been wonderful, thank you so much for letting us know a little bit about what you do in this topic. That is, I think, in the future going to be extremely important because we do need copper.
Max Porterfield
No, absolutely. I really appreciate you having me. You know, I like to say copper is the new gold. really precious, you know, I think people don't want to appreciate how precious copper truly is. They call doctor they call copper. Dr. Copper, because it's really a bellwether of the global economy is showing that the economy is obviously going very strong right now. And no matter the case, you know, things slow down or not. It's a very, very key metal at a very, very key time, as well shifts away from the hydrocarbon.
Mike Stohler
Yes. Well, thank you, sir. I appreciate you coming out. Have a great day.
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ABOUT MAX PORTERFIELD
Max Porterfield is the CEO, President, and Director of a successful mining company called Callinex Mines. Mr. Porterfield is well-known in Canada’s metal market. A graduate of Texas Tech University with a bachelor’s degree in business administration, Max has over ten years of experience in natural resources and finance; he previously worked with Brazil Resources Inc., Uranium Energy Corp., and U.S. Global Investors. Max has a vibrant and charismatic personality that comes across in his interviews. He is passionate and LOVES what he does.
Max Porterfield is the CEO, President, and Director of Callinex Mines. The company and mineral asset have a history that goes back to the 1920s, but Callinex Mines, founded by Jack Callinan in 1927, has had a major presence in the Flin Flon Mining District in Manitoba, Canada. What makes Callinex Mines a leading junior zinc stock? To start, a strong foundation built upon a proven technical team, zinc-rich deposits in established Canadian mining jurisdictions, and an established base of institutional shareholders. Their team brings over 40 years of experience and involvement with gold mining stocks, silver stocks, and zinc stocks. When looking for potential mining stocks or penny stocks to buy that can be a part of a larger diversified portfolio, Callinex Mines provides investors with considerable exposure to increasing metals prices and exciting new discovery potential.